Some Future Day

Marc Beckman: Yifat and Ofri, it's good to see you today. Welcome to, uh, my show, Some Future Day. It's really, truly an honor to have you both here today.
Yifat Zailer: Thank you for having us.
Ofri Bibas Levy: Thank
you.,
Marc Beckman: I know that you're very, you're both very active, um, and you have been for the past year, but I think it would be good for you both to take a second and introduce yourself. To my audience, and explain, um, not just your relationship, uh, to, to the Bibas family, but like who you are, like what, what you do in your life, um, as a, as a mother, as a person who works, like who, who are you guys?
Yifat Zailer: well, my name is Yifat Zeiler. I'm 38, just turned 38. I have two beautiful children, Daniela, who turned three last week, and Guy, who is one year and eight months old. Uh, I'm an architect. Uh, I studied a bit abroad, and then I returned home to Israel and finished my degree here in Jerusalem in the Bezalel Academy of Arts. but my love and my passion is for photography, my main focus is on documentary photography. Uh, I live in the center of Israel, lived here almost my entire life, uh, our origins are Argentinian, my mother and Shiri Bibas' father are brother and sister, so Shiri is my cousin. Uh, more can I say? I think this is me, shortly.
Marc Beckman: That's very nice. What type of architecture did you study?
Yifat Zailer: well, in Israel, you have one degree in architecture, you don't have urban design, it doesn't, well, basically in your, in your master's, it's, it's, you know, it divides into different subjects, um, but you know, everyone who studied architecture now, it's five years, gruesome years, where you, you grow, you go from, you know, being, uh, uh, tired for five years, and not sleeping, and so on. under stress
all for joining us today and I look forward to seeing you all
in the next session. home and living abroad alone. And, Coming back here with that perspective of learning architecture in different countries and then learning about, you know, architecture and East history and, you know, how everything became to be, you know, Bauhaus and all that history. so I feel, I feel very blessed to have that very, you know, long, long, long journey in my studies, but I feel everything that I did gave me something who made me who am I today. And even in my studies, I, I used photography all the time to express myself because drawing I was very, very bad. And sketching and, uh, uh, You know, so,
Marc Beckman: too.
Yifat Zailer: my way of expressing, you know, my ideas
through photography and through manipulation of photography and collages and stuff like that, so, yeah, but it feels, talking about it, you know, we, I think no one asked me about this
Marc Beckman: uh,
Yifat Zailer: for a year now, and talking about it, it seems like a lifetime ago.
Marc Beckman: A lifetime ago, but do you feel like it will come back at some point? Do you think you'll ever have a return for your, um, not just the love of the arts, but executing?
Yifat Zailer: I really hope so, because I miss creating. And I miss thinking, um, creatively. And of people ask me, why don't you document the journey, now, the struggle? And it's really hard to put myself in this. It's sort of a fly on the wall position when I, when I'm so in the center of everything. Some artists find it very, inspiring and gives, it gives them, you know, inspiration for their, you know, arts.
But for me, it's, it's been really, I, my camera is hidden somewhere in the closet. didn't hold it, I didn't see it, I didn't open the bag, I didn't clean it. It's, it's sort of. Everything froze, I think this is the best word to describe it.
Marc Beckman: I'm curious if, um, like, if you could take your mind back to October 6th, let's say, 2023, and you were thinking creatively at that point in time, maybe to create a gorgeous documentary, what was inspiring you creatively on October 6th, what, before this? this period of your life.
Yifat Zailer: Oh wow.
Marc Beckman: Do you remember?
Yifat Zailer: I had a few projects that I was working on. I was really focused around motherhood and the struggles of motherhood. Uh, since I have two very close children and becoming a mother was another huge lesson for me as an artist, as a woman.
all for
joining us today, and we hope to see
you again in
the future. Good night. types of mothers And, uh, it was really at the beginning, I was doing the research, um, and now talking about it, it's kind of, you know, thinking about my cousin, um, sorry, I know
Marc Beckman: That's okay.
Yifat Zailer: on, on, on, you know, when you hear
Marc Beckman: okay.
Yifat Zailer: it's
Marc Beckman: Take your time. That's okay.
Yifat Zailer: Thinking about the cousin and the kind of symbol of motherhood she became here in Israel. That video of her from October 7th. I never really thought about it in this connection from my previous work and this work because it's so personal. Shiri and my brother were born, were, uh, one month apart. Like, Shiri was born at
all for joining us today and
I look
forward to seeing you
all in the future.
she became this something that I cannot grasp, because she's my baby cousin, you know, she, she, she always will be, and it's again, it's this going in, going out story. It's my story, but it's not my story, I'm not telling it, I'm living it, and it's really really hard to disconnect the two. Liz
Marc Beckman: is,
the concept of motherhood is, you know, certainly something that shifts throughout time and depending on which side of motherhood you're on and I can, um, you know, that image that you are referencing of, of your cousin Shiri with, with the children in her arms is something now that's a global image, iconic of motherhood.
Ofri, I know that you are A mother too. Um, why don't you take a second and introduce yourself please and tell everybody about, um, you know, your background and who you are.
Ofri Bibas Levy: Um, so actually for the last, for the last year, I think every time I had to introduce myself and Third, the, the first thing I said is always, I say, is always, uh, name is Afri and I'm your then vi's sister. Uh, she's sister-in-Law. And
um. But before the 7th of October, I got used to introduce myself like this, but before the 7th of October I was, uh, I was Ofri, uh, Ofri Levy. Um, and I'm 38 years old, and I married, uh, to David. Um, We had two children to, she's five years old and, um, and fair, uh, sorry, Tom, she's five years old and negative is three years old.
Um, two weeks after the 7th of October, uh, I discovered I, I was pregnant with my third child. Uh, he was born five months ago. His name is a, um. Uh, I'm an occupational therapist. Uh, I worked mainly, um, in rehabilitation, neurological rehabil rehabilitation, and I just moved, um, about two months before 7th of October.
We moved, from a kibbutz, uh, really close to where Sherry and, uh, den live in Oz. Uh, I used to live in kibbutz, which is 10 minutes away from them. And we moved up north to the Golan Heights, me and my family. And we were just trying, just starting to get used to our new lives here, getting to know the community, and the children just started kindergarten, and I was supposed to start a new job in a hospital not far from where we live. Um, but it really seems like a A different life.
Marc Beckman: Do you,
Ofri Bibas Levy: I feel
Marc Beckman: do you,
Ofri Bibas Levy: a different person.
Marc Beckman: Yeah, I was gonna say, like, do you feel like you could unlock that part of you, um, you know, it's interesting in speaking with you both that we're, like, demarking, um, pre October 7th and post October 7th, but at the same time talking about how you would even introduce yourself to a person.
Right? Like, it's almost like a part of you both is also disappearing as time goes on. Um, do you think, do the, this is directed at you both, I guess, Ofer, you could start, like, do you think you'll be able to find that part of your, your, um, identity, that part of your soul, and unlock it again someday?
Ofri Bibas Levy: At the minute it's hard for me to say, it's hard to even imagine going back to any kind of routine or any kind of normal life. While they are still there, I can't even start to imagine it. Um, I just know that at the moment it's, so overwhelmed and so emotional and so, uh, occupied with, With the fight of bringing them back, I can't even imagine going back to work as a therapist and taking care of other people and managing to hold their pain while care of them. It's something that it's really hard for me to imagine at the moment. I know this year has changed me a lot. It's, um It's brought Uh, it made me do things that are way out of my comfort zone. Um, it made me, uh, I think I became less naïve, uh, I trust people less, me, my personality has changed for the last, for the last
Marc Beckman: Yeah.
Ofri Bibas Levy: I discovered I can, I can be angry, and I can, and I can be enraged, and I can, and I can scream sometimes, and things that were really not, not a part of who I used to be.
Marc Beckman: So, you know, it's interesting your perspective on the world, Ofri. I mean, you're a caretaker, um, professionally and personally, and, you know, obviously, Ariel and Kfir are the only children in captivity. Right now, um, and we all, the whole world obviously thinks about them every day and feels your energy, but you must have, uh, such a different perspective.
Like, I would imagine, uh, you must think of like, who's taking care of them and who's feeding them. And, you know, emotional, uh, physical connection is important. I remember once my wife and I visited, and Orphanage in Prague many, many years ago, probably like 20 years ago, and they were talking about how they provide therapy for these orphans by hugging the young children and all.
So I imagine, um, these topics must, um, constantly be on your mind. It sounds like that's the your human nature, Ofri, is that you're a caretaker, you're a giver. Like, do you think about that level of detail as it relates to Ariel and Kafir?
Ofri Bibas Levy: sometimes I try to really, um, like block those thoughts uh, sometimes it's too hard to handle, uh, and, and cope with, with thinking about, um, exactly, or thinking or imagining exactly the condition they are held in or What they are going through there, it's just, it's just too hard for the soul, basically.
my oldest daughter, she's five years old, she's two months apart from Maria, they were born two months apart, and every time I look at her, every time I put her to sleep, she's Every time I give her a hug, every time I see her doing something new, learning something new, just growing up, my mind is like constantly putting Ariel beside her and trying to imagine him in the same situation and how he would behave or what he would say or how would he be acting if he was here right now with us. Um, it's like, um, Like a mirror all the time, he's always here next to her, uh, Can you, can, can,
and, and my baby is now five months old, um, and the same with Arielle, sometimes I, I seek fearing him. Like he's playing on the, playing on the floor and he is holding, uh, some kind of toy. Uh, and immediately my mind goes to, uh, the famous picture of, uh, fear holding the, the purple elephant.
we actually like, like a toy that looks a lot like the, like this purple elephant. And I, And I didn't, at the beginning, I didn't understand why, why? Why I stopped when I see, when I saw him playing with it, uh, what stopped me? And, and then I realized it was just too similar to, to Kfir's picture. And, and ever since that, that elephant is somewhere deep in, in the toys and I, I, I don't give it to him anymore.
Uh, and it just, I just started feeding him with, uh, with solid food. Um, and as I'm feeding him with, and it's a, like a very. Cute and, and, and happy phase of, of, of the baby, of trying, starting to eat, uh, solid food. And, and the, the thing I remembered it and went inside my head is, is, is Kfir's video when Shiri is starting to feed him, uh, the video she shared with us with the family when she was starting to feed him, uh, uh, solid food.
So yeah, it's like, they're not here, but they are here all the time. They are next to us, and in my mind, 24 7, and it's really hard to to ever put it aside. I worry about them 24 7, and I take a hot shower, and I think, when was the last time they had a shower? I, uh, I eat, I give my children food for breakfast, or for lunch, or dinner, or whatever, and, and I wonder if they ate for the last week, or when was their last meal.
And now winter is starting, I just finished covering them with, each one of them with two blankets, because it's starting to be so cold, and I don't know where Kfir I don't know if they are cold, if they are warm. I don't know if they're If they're still alive, I just, I just don't know. Yeah,
Marc Beckman: a minute. Um, like what were they like? What, what, tell me like, what is Clingendael? Like, Kafir and Ariel, like, how would you describe their personalities? Like, we just see their images all over the world, but you know them. Let's talk about them, like, did they, I know they were young, but, you know, they still, you could start to see, like, a personality, and humor, big smiles, sometimes the kids are nagging.
Um, how would you describe their personalities? Who are they? as people.
Ofri Bibas Levy: um, I think the first thing that comes to my mind about Ariel is, uh, first is his energy, never sits down, he's always on the move, always, um, um, and is a really, A really good friend, uh, for my daughter, uh, for Toam, every time he came to, to my mother's house, uh, and, and we didn't, and he came alone and Toam wasn't there.
Every time my mother and his grandmother would give him. like a candy, he always said, but we have to keep one for Toam, you have to keep one for Toto, uh, keep one for her, and where is she? Why is she not here? He was always asking for her, and always, uh, sending us videos of him, uh, of Shiri filming him, saying how much he misses her, and invited, inviting us, us to, to come to their house and play with him, so he was really
Marc Beckman: He was generous. He was generous right? A little guy, but generous and also compassionate.
Ofri Bibas Levy: Yeah.
Marc Beckman: Am I right?
Ofri Bibas Levy: Yeah. Yeah. Also, also, uh, for Kfir, he was very, like, uh, he really loved being a big brother for Kfir, um, taking care of him, hugging him all the time, uh, kissing him, playing with him, um, and he's, yeah, he's Again, he's very energetic and very, very much a boy. He likes superheroes and he likes the, everything that has a and loves playing in the garden.
Every time he came to my mother's house, it was straight from the main door to the garden, starting to with the, um, how you say it?
Marc Beckman: With a shovel.
Ofri Bibas Levy: Shovel, yeah. With a shovel and just buckets
Marc Beckman: Did he get that from, did he get that from, from your brother? Did he get that?
That from Yarden? no, we are the eight walking in the garden. He always to my mom, if you want something in the garden, just pay someone. I would never do it. But But with the vehicles, yes, Yarden was, uh, uh, really passionate about vehicles and, uh, and motorcycles and everything, related to it, yeah.
Ofri Bibas Levy: He
Marc Beckman: I noticed, um, in, in starting to pay closer attention to Yarden, the individual, I see he had some cool tattoos on his arms and he looked like a, um, really rugged, cool person. Is that, is that how you would describe him at all? How, how would you, uh, kind of, how would you bring his personality to life?
If you, what, what's he like?
Ofri Bibas Levy: looks very, say it, rugged? He looks Yeah. big and strong, he is very Yeah. but, uh, he's like a teddy bear. He is the most sensitive and gentle. Man, I know, um, he just always, always cares about his, everybody else, um, making sure everybody's is okay and feeling good and, and, and just worried about everybody.
Uh, on that Saturday, he, he, On 6. 30 in the morning, when everything started, he even called my mother, just making sure that she's okay, and making sure that our grandfather that lives in Ashkelon is okay. Even called from the house. yeah, from the
Marc Beckman: He was home.
Ofri Bibas Levy: room.
Marc Beckman: Yeah. Oh, he was already in that safe room. were
Ofri Bibas Levy: in the safe room, and Even though he's my younger sister, younger brother, sorry, I always felt like he's my biggest brother, like he's always taking care of me, always making sure I'm okay. I always knew that if I want help in anything, I can call him and he will come.
be late, but he will come. And,
Marc Beckman: He's late right now. He's late right now.
Ofri Bibas Levy: 410 days late.
Marc Beckman: He's coming. He's coming. So, um, Yifat, then, you know, maybe it would be good for you, since you're Shiri's cousin, to talk a little bit about who she is, um, you know, it's, again, it's like, I haven't thought about this before speaking with either of you, but, you know, all I do is see that image in the video of her, you know, it's so striking, but I don't know her.
Um, did she, you know, does she also have a similar type of compassion and love? A person that, is she a person that would be on, on time to meet? Is, is she a person that was, um, you know, into nature? How, how would, what is she like? What, what is, what's like your favorite part of her?
Yifat Zailer: first of all, she's amazing. She's an amazing mother. But I'm not just saying it, you know, because of the situation that we're living now. Being older than her, watching her becoming a mother before I did, uh, I was, I felt so proud. Watching her with, you know, Riel when he was only one year old, or it was just a baby.
For me, I discovered a new Shiri. I know, I've known all my life how much she wanted to become a mother. Like her mother, she studied education. Her mother was one of the, you know, um, She was one of the kindergartens in the kibbutz, kindergartners. You know, she, she Help raised, you know, I think two or three generations in the kibbutz and everyone, you know, my, my aunt, my late aunt, Margit.
Marc Beckman: Marguite, Marguite was, um, uh, so she was teaching all the children
in the kibbutz, like the whole community knew her.
Yifat Zailer: she was, um, how do you say it in English? She was a kindergartner. She,
Marc Beckman: Yeah.
Yifat Zailer: you know, in the kibbutz, it's inside the kibbutz, you don't go outside. So basically it's like a minute walk from your home and you go in with the same group of. who were born in the same year and you are basically going from kindergarten then to preschool all together and Margit, my aunt, she was one of those characters that all the children of the kibbutz even now, you know, remember from their childhood she looked like Snow White and very silent and very gentle and she really took those qualities from her mother she she's she's very gentle and very kind and loving and then she has this laugh that you don't know where it comes from because it's this like very loud rolling snoring laugh laughter and think this is one of my favorite favorite things about her the way she laughs and I really like it Shiri has an older sister, Dana, and they're so different from one another. Like, Dana used to climb on trees and Shiri used to play with makeup and dolls. And, uh, God, I'm sorry, I really miss her. Instead of being easier talking about her, it only becomes harder. I told, I told, you know,
Marc Beckman: I can't even imagine.
Yifat Zailer: reporters and people who asked about her and about her life and likes and dislikes and All I want is her to come back. Really, all I want is her to, to, to. I want to hear her laughter again. I want to hear her voice. I never in my life never spoke to my cousin for more than a year. Never. It's
Marc Beckman: If she, if she, could hear you today. If she could hear you speaking with me today, what would you tell her?
Yifat Zailer: all for joining us today,
and we hope to see you
again soon.
she
all for joining us today.
I'll probably, I feel ashamed and I feel that I need to apologize to her. I know that we're doing the best that we can but still this kind of feeling, I know Ofri feels the same way. It haunts us that we, that It's taking so long, and it's now 410 days since October 7th, since they were taken from us.
Marc Beckman: what, what was,
Ofri Bibas Levy: and
Marc Beckman: um, her parents
Ofri Bibas Levy: forward
Marc Beckman: know, um, I saw photos of, of, her parents and they were really gorgeous people. Um, Yossi looked so cool. He looked like a cool guy. Was, was he a cool guy?
Yifat Zailer: Yeah, he was.
Marc Beckman: What was Yossi like?
Yifat Zailer: He's the dictionary definition of a redhead Argentinian with boiling blood, and so he, when he loves you, he loves you deeply, and when he argues with you, he will argue, you know, until Forever. he has, he was very talented painter.
Marc Beckman: I've read that. What type of painting did he do?
Yifat Zailer: Oh, from abstract to portraiture. He, he actually, uh, one of his biggest project was to paint everyone in the community, in the kibbutz. He had a lot of portraits of some of the people who were killed on October 7th. And people still all for joining us today, and I look forward to seeing you all
Marc Beckman: burned.
Yifat Zailer: were all
Ofri Bibas Levy: the
Marc Beckman: whole house burned? Was that?
Yifat Zailer: Yes,
Marc Beckman: I'm so, I'm so
sorry. only pillars who stayed, you know, but it's all ashes.
Ofri Bibas Levy: all
Marc Beckman: of time in, in that community? Were you, were you, um, were you there a lot? What, like what was the community? We, we, so like here in the United States, we see the images on television of like what you're describing now, like the, you know, the blood and the, you know, the, the, the, the, fire remnants and, and all.
What was it like before
Yifat Zailer: Well, for me,
for joining us today, and I look forward to seeing you all next week.
every holiday, as children especially, I remember doing the, the long, long way, okay, for you Americans it will sound now very, very funny, but an hour and a half from Tel Aviv to, to Niros for us
for joining. for having me. So, I'm
going to start by saying I'm a Clingendael friend shoring, Clingendael
Institute, and I'm a house and freely, and they can sleep, you know, at friend's house.
And for me, I grew up in a city, you know, with very anxious parents who you don't go anywhere alone and you have to wear your shoes everywhere you go. And the kibbutz was freedom and everyone knows each other and it's all green and full of grass and really beautiful people, literally. Brilliant. I always wanted to move to the kibbutz, and I really did, and I spent most of my summer breaks between, you know, school and in the kibbutz. But I was always a foreigner to them. I was the girl from the city. you
Marc Beckman: you were in
Yifat Zailer: tell easily that I'm not from there, but I loved spending time there with my grandparents, both of my grandparents and my cousins. I have a lot of memory from the kibbutz.
Marc Beckman: Yeah, yeah, I'm sure.
Ofri Bibas Levy: I think for So. it was really, for Shiri it was really important that her children will grow up in the kibbutz as well, even when they thought about moving from Liroz because they felt like the situation there with all the rockets The situation was really hard for them and they didn't want their children to up fearing and like traumatic with every noise and always scared and always I was waiting for the next round of rockets, so they were thinking about leaving you oars, but, um,
Yifat Zailer: And it's actually something that they always said how this beautiful place can turn in a second into a war zone.
Marc Beckman: They predicted it.
Yifat Zailer: They have seven seconds since they hear the red alert, the alarm, to get into the safe room. This is how close they are to the border. Seven seconds. Here in Tel Aviv, we have a minute and a half. So, raising children in that environment always raised questions, even for us. We always, when every round started, every round of attacks, They said please come here, please stay here. They were so connected to that place, uh, and I can understand why. They really hoped for better and different days.
Marc Beckman: Well, can I ask you, like, this is going to sound, you know, um, you know, I live in New York city, right? What, what was the safe room? Like, what's it like? Like, so is it like you enter a different area in the home and it's, is it a hidden area that people can't see? And then like, what's a safe room? Can you explain that to me?
Like, what is exactly like the architecture of a safe room?
Ofri Bibas Levy: Yeah, I just, I just wanted to
Marc Beckman: You're laughing at me, but I don't, I'm sorry.
Ofri Bibas Levy: No, I, no, no,
I'm laughing because I just thought,
Yifat Zailer: about, you know, like
Ofri Bibas Levy: I just thought if I could explain it better.
Yifat Zailer: a, uh, uh,
Marc Beckman: know I sound foolish. I know I sound ridiculous, but they're like, I would, I'm willing to bet like most of my friends, most people even watching this don't know, you know, unless they're from Israel, they don't know what the safe room actually is.
Ofri Bibas Levy: Basically, basically, it's just like an extra. just like a bedroom, um, but the walls and the ceiling is much thicker than normal, uh, than, than the entire house. It's, it's thicker it has like a very, a very heavy metal, uh, door, which on the 7th of October we discovered is not bullet uh, something that those safe rooms were built, uh, to protect against rockets.
Um,
Marc Beckman: against this type of,
Ofri Bibas Levy: Yeah. And on the 7th of October, we just, we discovered that bullets can go through this door, uh, with no problem.
Marc Beckman: so for your brother and your brother and his family went into the safe room and then, and then you know that they were shooting through the door. Is that what happened?
Ofri Bibas Levy: we didn't know exactly what happened. I was texting my brother. Um, I couldn't call him because I knew they had to be silent. Um, But we, we were texting, up to the minute, up till the till the minute he wrote to me the last message, which was, uh, they are coming inside. Uh, it meant the terrorists were, um, breaking inside their house.
Um, and later, that were released and, uh, were held in the tunnels with Den us that, what he told them was that. They could hear the terrorists going inside their house. Um, he thought that, um, they didn't, they wouldn't touch or take or do anything for, uh, to a woman and, and, and a child and a baby.
So he, he kissed them goodbye and, uh, and just stepped outside of the safe room thinking they will take him and leave them and That they didn't, they won't harm Shiri and the boys. Um, so we stepped outside the safe room. We don't know exactly what happened, uh, in those seconds or minutes. but when we came to the house we could see a lot of, um, bullets, uh, holes.
Uh, in the walls, in the In the refrigerator, in the kitchen cupboards, and it looks like it came from both ways. So Yarden had his personal gun, so it looks like he fired a few at him, but we don't know for sure. Um, I, I really don't know how, how, how did he even survive this situation. Uh, yeah.
on the 7th of October, I first, first, my first thought was that Jordan was killed in the house, that he was murdered when we didn't see him in the video with Shiri and the boys. Later we learned he was taken first, and then another group came and took Shiri and the boys. And was taken. Um, soon enough that he didn't even see the cheer and the boys were taken, and he thought for the first two months in captivity, he thought the cheer and the boys were Wayne as well, and that they were safe. Um, he thought, he thought that until, basically, until hamma, eh, filmed him for the, um, in the video, the horrific video of the, of your end.
That was, uh. Published from inside the, the tunnels, um, so yeah, so, so on the 7th of October we learned that the door of the safe room is not bulletproof and we learned that you can't lock the safe room from inside, um, so people, of the men that were inside the safe room, usually it was the men, uh, that just held the, um, the door.
Uh, sometimes for eight hours, 12 hours, just holding the door so that the terrorist can't open it, uh, from outside. Um, so I dunno exactly what happened, but, uh, but it looks like, uh, fires were shot. We know that, uh, the dog was killed in the, in the living room. Shot in the living room. Um, and then was taken, uh, was taken later on.
Was, uh. was hit by a mass, people, um, like a massive group of people that just came to basically to kill him and, and the terrorists to kindle him so they pushed them aside and say go away, don't kill him and they wanted him alive so it would be to, to take him hostage alive so you could say they kept him alive.
As weird as it sounds.
Marc Beckman: Yeah, it does sound pretty. Pretty weird, honestly. Um, you know, what, what do you, what do you, um, tell your children, Ofri? Like, you know, that, I mean, part of it, like, I see how the two of you are impacted, and I can only imagine your families, but how are your children processing, you know, where their cousins are?
Like, what, what do they, where do they think their cousins are now?
Ofri Bibas Levy: So my five years old is, uh, she felt right away that something not good is happening. She could see me and the first few days I was, I was like, uh, possessed and just. crying all the time and hidden in the room and on the phone all the time and very, very anxious and nervous and she could straight away understand that something happened, something bad happened.
So she started asking a lot of questions and really didn't know what to tell her. How you tell a five years old that her best friend has been kidnapped from his bed and without And making sure that she still feels safe in, in her own way, her own bed. Sorry. Um, but, uh, I think the, in the first week already, we told her, uh, we told her that Ariel was taken, Ariel and, and entire family was taken and we don't know where they are.
And I told her that a lot of good people and a lot of soldiers are looking for them. Um, as time goes by and, and, and the, they're not coming back, the questions becoming harder and harder, uh, she, she can ask me, like, she said to me, it's been so long and they, they didn't come back, so it means they are dead, right? Or she told me, um, they can be either in Egypt or under the ground or, or maybe they are dead. Uh,
Marc Beckman: That's incredible.
Ofri Bibas Levy: so much. When, when will I see, when will I see, she calls him Luli. When, when will I see Luli again? Uh, you know where he is? Um, so a lot of questions and the most difficult thing for me this year was all the uncertainty about everything, basically.
We don't know anything about anything. So, uh, and I have to, I have to make sense. In all this madness, I have to try and make sense for her, but I don't have the answer, so I just tell her what I know, and I tell her we don't know. know if they're dead or alive, I
Marc Beckman: Okay, okay.
Ofri Bibas Levy: back, but we miss them, and we love them, and we are hoping that they will come back.
Marc Beckman: Can,
Ofri Bibas Levy: he knows that
Marc Beckman: does it, I mean, how do you make sense even for yourself of,
Ofri Bibas Levy: We're not. you know?
It's, I sit here with you today and, uh, and I go through life and starting, uh, trying to make some kind of routine for my kids, uh, at least a basic kind of routine, but every now and then it just hits me and, and, and my mind's trying to, uh, to, to make sense and to, to even start and, and.
Grasping the thought that as I'm sitting here with you, my brother is in the tunnels, underground in Gaza, and trying to understand in some way that I don't know where Shiri and the boys are. And it's even after 410 days now and if this makes sense, it's my reality, but I still can understand it and can believe it that this thing happened and it happened and it's still going on and
Marc Beckman: It's hard to believe, even like when you look at Kfir's life, he's now spent more of his life in captivity than free, and this is a very, um, critical time with regards to development for, for young children. Probably at the age now where he's, uh, learning to walk and learning to speak, you know, these are, this is a, uh, you know, terrible situation on so many levels.
You, I think you'd mentioned that, we're about to enter the second winter. You, you had just said it's getting cold in Israel and you're putting two blankets on your children. Um, do you ever, does anybody even talk about, like, the developmental piece for, for these children? Like, is, other than yourselves, like, is anyone publicly, um, speaking out about the, this type of, um, topic as it relates to CAFIR's development as a person?
Is it just you? They
Ofri Bibas Levy: we were trying really hard to convey exactly this message, meeting with UNICEF, and meeting with the Red Cross, and meeting whoever we can, and that was exactly the thing that we were talking about, about the critical that fear was. eight and a half months old, our lack of food and lack of vitamins and, um, and air and, and sunlight can cause damage for, for his development, for his life.
Um, I remember talking a lot at the beginning about, uh, the fact that, uh, Ariel was underweight. He was a really skinny boy, uh, he had really hard, uh, it was really hard for him to gain weight. So, I always thought about, how can he survive with, uh, With basically no food, uh, how can he lose more weight than he's already so, so tiny and so, so underweight.
So at the beginning, we really, we really talked about this lot, all the time. Um, I can say, I didn't really feel that somebody's hearing me on the other side. I think, uh, uh, it's been, I think, one of the most, uh, Uh, tough struggle is against, uh, this kind of organizations. Um, I felt a lot of, in the good case, I felt empathy sometimes.
Not even that, um, but a lot of, a lot of, a lot of answers that were like, I don't know. Um. Cleaning them from their responsibility of taking care for those two boys. And,
Marc Beckman: haven't. I mean, the bottom line is that from what I'm hearing on the news here, that it's been, like, totally vapid. Like, there's no organization, there's no entity, not the UN, not the Red Cross. There's nobody that's really come out vocally to talk about these two children. Right?
Ofri Bibas Levy: and as time passes, as stamp, as time passes and, and all the images from Gaza are flooding the world, terrible images and. Uh, of course it's, it's, it's even hard for me to see those pictures and I think, I think no child should be a victim of a war and children should be part, shouldn't be part of, of wars.
Um, and as those images are flooding the world, I think it's even, uh, it makes our fight, uh, even harder to, to keep and remind everyone that, uh, Also two Israeli boys, Kfir and Ariel, that were taken from their beds and they are being held by a terrorist organization. They are hostages for more than one year and the fact that we feel like nobody is still talking about it.
Um. And is concerning, uh, for a good reason, uh, about the children in Gaza, uh, but they are not talking anymore about Ariel and Fir,
sorry. We have a lot of friends here in, in New York who are, um, you know, they'll, they'll constantly speak about, um, the Gazan children and never speak about the Israeli children. Never.
Marc Beckman: You know, it's pretty wild.
Ofri Bibas Levy: I'm not trying to, justify or, or
Marc Beckman: Nor am I.
Ofri Bibas Levy: for, for children, for Gazan children, uh, getting killed or getting injured, but
Marc Beckman: Same. Of course.
Of course. Look,
Ofri Bibas Levy: over there, and the world should talk about them and feel responsible for their life as much.
Marc Beckman: It's hard to get your voice out now. I think it's tough to break through, right, Ofri? I think that's the, that's the reality. Like, you've met, you've fought, you've met several, I think, really strong influential leaders now, right? Haven't, haven't you met some People that have some power politically and all in the Israeli government and beyond, but um, I think at some point, uh, the, the politicians are proving that they're not capable of, you know, the level of humanity that your family deserves, and certainly that these two children deserve, because people are just not moving quick enough.
These children need to be rescued today, right now. There's, there's no time. Like, time is up. Now is the time for them to be saved. Um, obviously here in the United States, we just had a presidential election, and we have a new president coming in. If, if you thought, if you were, if you had the chance to sit down with President Trump, what would you say to him?
What would you ask him to do?
Yifat Zailer: Oh, wow. Uh, I think you said it, I think once, You touched a point, once politics got involved into this, uh, we lost the humanitarian issue. The humanitarian problem, that we feel left alone, left behind. you said, you asked before, Did anyone step up and talk about, you know, their condition, their development, other than you?
And listening to Afri's questions, she's basically saying, yes, only us. one for, for more than a year stood up and said, okay, you can the Israeli government's decision, or you can be pro Palestinian, but do you remember that children are children? And there are two boys who are taken from their bed on October 7th, with their pyjamas, bare feet. And feels like only us are, are, are, here now, after a year, telling the story over and over again. Hopefully someone will hear us and reach out and say, okay, wait, there's a conflict and, you know, 70 years conflict. Kfir and Ariel were just two children on one side of the border. It's not their fault. They won't
for joining us. This is my house. This is my home. This is my home.
This is my home. This is my home.
You know, I'm gonna say something, but it sounds, you know, completely odd coming from me, but even hostages have rights, right? The Red Cross was created, there's amendments, there's, they should be visited or treated properly, getting medicine, there's a right that are, are,
all for
joining us today, and we hope to
see you all again soon. ask him for, for his help. I would try to listen to what he
for joining us. My
name is Jon
Bumhoffer. I'm the CEO of Hotel
Moment. I'm here to
talk to you about, um, the new hotel, the new hotel. So, um, And I'm afraid that someone, every day, that someone will enter the door of my home and take me and my children. those are voices that I always silence. I said, there are people like me on the other side, Palestinian, who just want to co exist, and then October 7th happened to us, very left wing, very peaceful people, who just want to live in Israel, peacefully,
all for joining us today, and I look forward to
seeing you all again soon. but I see the, the, the rallies and the people in the streets and the universities and the streets in Europe, and I ask, and I want to ask them, when you're shouting Intifada, do you understand what you are saying? Uh, we were both raised during the Second Intifada, where buses and restaurants were exploded here. We were both 12 and 13, raising to be fearful. Raising to be anxious and constantly afraid for our lives. you have to keep reminding yourself that no, those are only the extremists, right? Someone who someday will come here and fix the Middle East and we'll all,
And this is a project that
was put together in the spirit of, uh, the idea of, uh, the idea of, uh, the idea of a new hotel. And, uh, I'm sure that many of you know that,
uh, the idea of a new hotel is that. it's not a hotel, it's a city. So, the idea of a new hotel is that it's a
city. they're on the bad side. How can you do that? Do you understand? We need to invent a new vocabulary. Those are children. Their parents were, on October 6th, put them to bed, like everyone who's listening gonna put their children to bed tonight. And just imagining, 6. 30 in the morning, by 10 o'clock they were all taken. Their grandparents, Kfir and Ariel's grandparents killed, burned alive. A painter and a Parkinson's disease kindergarten teacher, with Parkinson's disease, who had nothing, no way to
Good morning. Good morning. Good
morning. know, is this war okay,
all for joining us today,
and I look forward to seeing
you all in the future. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye.
Bye. Bye. Bye. back. They're not kind of, they're being played as pawns in this very cruel, vicious game. And we stay, we really try to stay and remind ourselves our values and the way we were educated and to show the world maybe a different kind of, know, perspective of what they think about Israel.
Yeah,
Marc Beckman: I see that. I see that. I was thinking about your comment about living in fear, legitimate fear, that somebody's going to come through your door right now and, um, kidnap you and your loved ones. I mean, that's literally in the middle of trauma. And I don't know, plus everything else that you just, you know, that you're going through, um, missiles being launched into your neighborhoods and having, uh, family members being held Hostage and family members who have been murdered and burned alive.
I mean, this is just such a It's just it's a nightmare. I feel like it's not we're talking about something. That's not even real. I don't know Obviously, I'm at a total loss of words clearly, but I you're struggling with these different ideas of like, should we stop the war? Do we continue the war?
Can we beat Hamas? Can we, you know, can we trust the Gazans in the future? Like, all of these issues just seem so much bigger than just the two children that we're talking about, Ariel and Kfir. It's like, uh, they literally, we need to isolate, we need to All of that stuff from just these two young boys. I don't, I don't remember ever before in history young children like this being held hostage underground by a terrorist organization.
I've never heard of such a thing in my life. And you know, all of what you just painted is, um, just so complicated on so many levels and, you know, dark versus light, good versus bad. And I just, you know, at the end of the day, we have to remember that these are just People, like, they're just people. They were just, like you said, they were just at home in their pajamas.
They went to bed on October 6th, they were put to bed in their comfort of their home from their mom. And, and then all of a sudden, here we are. It's horrific.
Ofri Bibas Levy: Basically those kids should not be, even those kids shouldn't be negotiable. It's, it's their lives. And if I said it's, it's, life became part of a very big and, uh, vicious game of, of power and interest and politics. And, and on the 7th of October, uh, a lot of people conception in Israel is broken.
Um. if, if we want to, if we want to start and, and think about a better future here in Israel and, and, the people that are caring for the Palestinians, and if we want to, if we want to start and, and think about a solution, to think about a better future. And I think for me, uh, as much as 7th of October hurt, hurt me personally and my family.
Um. I can't imagine a situation if, if I want to start and, and if I want to stay and, and raise my children here, I have to hope that something better will come. Uh,
Marc Beckman: think it will,
Ofri Bibas Levy: I think the first thing that has to be done for, for us to start, and start building a better future here is for the hostages to come back.
Until the hostages are not home, 7th of October is still going on. It, it, it never ended for us. They had, they have to come back and then we can start, start to, to think about the future. But I always say the minute, the second I lose hope for a better future is the second I will take my bags and my children and move to another country.
Marc Beckman: do you still feel, uh, confident that, um, peace will be. Like peace is, is going to happen in that region of the world in your, in your home?
Ofri Bibas Levy: It's a hard question. It's really hard. As I I know. has been broken on the 7th. But, I know. But again, it's something that I have to believe in. I have to believe that a better future can't be, not can't, sorry, that a better future can be achieved. It won't be easy, and Israel can't do it alone, and Israel, and Hamas will have to be diminished as part of this future.
Marc Beckman: Do you think Hamas will ever be diminished though? Do you think they'll ever be defeated? Like I had a conversation just, um, earlier today about this idea like, you know, Hamas is antisemitism and now we see antisemitism all over the world. It's more than just a terrorist organization, you know, in your backyard.
It's actually all of antisemitism. Do you think that we can stop that? We could reverse that?
Ofri Bibas Levy: Israel can't do it alone, for sure. It has to That's for sure. a global, uh, intervention or with global help.
Marc Beckman: I don't know how, um, you know, it's like the families, we were talking about the humanitarian side. It's as if the families are, it's like the families versus the world, right? Because you have all the political maneuvering happening internally in Israel. Then you have these organizations that you think might help you Red Cross, the United Nations, the United States government, the President of the United States.
But all of, you know, over and over again, what the repeated theme is, is where's the humanity? Where are the people? And
it's like,
Yifat Zailer: you all for being here today, and I look forward to seeing you all in the future. Uh, who Shiri is, who Yarden is.
all for joining us today, and I look forward to seeing you all in the next I want to see them grow up, uh,
Marc Beckman: you will, you will, you will. the two of you have compassion? For the Gazan people, has it changed?
Yifat Zailer: I think, I think it's an important, uh, topic, it's a hard question, no doubt, uh, to have compassion, course. Um, I expose myself to foreign media, to TikTok, Instagram, uh, you know, trying to read bigger picture. Even in my darkest times where I'm focused on my family and trying to get them released, I, I have to, knowledge is power and you need to understand what's going on.
And I know by name, know, all the, some of the, some of the children who died during this war in Gaza. And I think for my children's sake and a better future here, I really do need to have this compassion towards the children on the other side because they're gonna be raised, they're gonna grow up, and if they're gonna grow up thinking that, you know, we hate them and we want them dead, then this cycle will never end, this cycle of vengeance. I will raise my children to, to have compassion to whomever is different from them, religion, color. So, I hope there are parents like us on the other side who will do the same.
Marc Beckman: Humanity,
Yifat Zailer: Humanity,
Marc Beckman: right? Humanity. Um, I finish every single show the same way. I start a sentence and then my guest finishes it. I incorporate the name of the show. Some future day, Ofri, I see you smiling, um, into, into it. Are you guys game for that? If we, if we do that together? Okay. Um, In some future day, humanity will.
So I haven't planned this, right? So I'm just trying to react to, uh, you know, to us talking right now. Yes, in some future day, humanity will.
Ofri Bibas Levy: Step up.
Yifat Zailer: prevail, I guess.
Marc Beckman: I hope so. I hope we can. Thank you so much both for your, your time today. Um, you know, I'm giving you love. I don't know what to say. I, I love you guys and your families and I'm only wishing the best for, for you truly, like from the bottom of my heart. Um, you know, for you and your families. So, thank you.
Yifat Zailer: Thank you very much.
Marc Beckman: I hope you guys can try to find some peace this evening.
Ofri Bibas Levy: Thank you. Great.